Curse

KingAlkaiser · Jul 23, 2012, 09:39 AM // 09:39

hello I am hoping to get some suggestions on heroes and necromancer player composition to steam roll through PvE only and get points for 30/50 of HoM.

You guys can look me up:
im 10/50

i have cleared a lot already and most of the rest of stuff is urgoz warren/the deep/etc specially clear nightfall which i found a tad boring before.

I usually run SS player necro or MM depending on area.

what hero team build should i get or build to help me steam roll through a lot fo the PvE normal only stuff like eye of north books and nightfall full clear?

any suggestions is greatly appreciated, i am having hard time making a hero team because necro plays a bit like support and a lot of team builds i see have a lot of support heroes already in them specially necro to fill in spot so what can i do as necro player?

akelarumi · Jul 23, 2012, 10:36 AM // 10:36

Hiya,

First of all in my opinion though Necro can play a suppot role but they are also very good as a damage/nuker. I suspect your using minions? For playing with heroes I would leave the minions to your heroes and run yourself a damage orientated caster build. Using curses like Spitefull spirit are a great way on doing that.

You can also play a necro/rit build with SoS and other spirits very well. (though your spirits aren't as strong then with a rit, you make that up cause you gain energy faster when you kill things.)

Dar Drakor · Jul 23, 2012, 02:30 PM // 14:30

This is what I currently use (playing a Rit nowadays) in an 8 man party (me and 7 heroes) for general HM PVE use (all using pretty much standard builds you can find in pvxwiki):

Me - SoS (I like to include EVAS...even if just as a distraction since monsters tend to focus initial attacks on him)
Master (NF) - Minion bomber (AoTL is the elite)
Razah (NF) - SoGM
Xandra (EOTN) - ST
Olias (NF & Proph) - SS Necro
Norgu (NF) - Psychic Instability
Gwen (EOTN) - Panic
Dunkoro (NF) - LoD (with Dwaynas Sorrow which synergizes extremely, extremely well with minions especially if the minions tend to blow up quickly)

Only time I die nowadays is when I fall asleep at the computer (which I actually do quite a bit lol) and even then really only in elite areas or if I get seriously mobbed. I believe the above is a pretty standard 7 hero mix for a lot of people (I think some run a different monk build..UA...etc).

Recommendation: If you haven't already done so I would strongly recommend that you purchase the skill packs (yes all of them if you can afford them) for the anet store. If you really want to maximize hero builds you need to have access a lot of skills. Now you can go buying them from skill trainers or, for elite skills, capping them but it takes time and if you are in a rush to get HOM up you don't want to waste time tracking down skills.

As far as the heroes listed...the hardest two to get (relatively speaking since none of them are really that hard, hard to get) are Razah (which you can only get after you complete NF...and the quest that gets him is a little nasty for people not prepared for it) and Xandra (more of a pain than anything else since she doesn't necessarily always appear when doing the quest in EOTN that allows you to potentially unlock her).

Everyone else is pretty easy early-ish on IF you didn't choose their counterparts instead (if you chose Margrid instead of Masters and Goren instead of Norgu). If you did then you will need to wait until you finish NF to get either or both.

From an equipment standpoint, I equip each hero on the list with a superior rune specific to their build along with a max vigor rune and pretty much max them out with mods on their armor. But not really necessary (just makes it even easier). For weps, I use +5e head with +30 health wrap along with +5e^50 insc, pretty much standard for every spell casting hero (some people will argue that +5 armor is better than +30 but I really don't care). If funds are an issue then you really don't need superior runes or max vigor runes. For weapons, instead of spending money trying to put together gold versions of weps google/wiki green weapons and find the ones with stats that you want and then either: a) go to Kamadan and look to buy it, b) use the Buy forum here to ask for others to sell it to you or c) check the auctions here to see if anyone is selling it. Green weapons come with the mods already in place and generally do not go for more than 5k each (whereas it could cost upwards of 10-15k to "make" a similar weapon from a gold item). Of if you really don't care about skin of weps on your heroes the NF endgame green staves (Staff of the Forgotten) is perfect. Just look for ones with primary attribute of: 2x domination (Panic and PsychInst), 1x communing (SoGM), 1x spawning power (ST), 1x divine favor or healing (monk), 1x curses (SS necro), 1x death or soul reaping (MM).

As far as which necro build you want to run for yourself? Really depends on what you like more (SS or MM). When I play my necro I perfer MM. Make sure you use your minion list (default 'Y') since it makes the "bomb prepping" part much easier. MM definitely keeps you more on your toes...which is probably why I prefer it to other necro builds.

Kafiri_Mkorogai · Jul 24, 2012, 06:54 AM // 06:54

Dar, doesn't your ST rit lose its spirits rather quickly with the minions eating up all of the hits?

Relyk · Jul 24, 2012, 10:32 AM // 10:32

Minions will only cause the ST rit to overcast if they get trained or hit by AoE, just like a party. It doesn't matter if you kill mobs quickly.

SS or MM are both dull to play. Use Fevered Dreams, AP caller, or IV nuker. Grab Markway or one of the other hero teams on gwpvx. There are more than enough threads about what necro players should use here on guru.

Treat time as money for 30/50. You can get minipets for cheap, grab a rare minipet and stop at 20. Hero armor is very easy to obtain. Getting the next point in companion takes less time than the others. You can stop at 5 statues for honor, clearing NM and HM missions on any of the campaigns does not take long. eotn armor is very cheap to get, clearing eotn and handing in the book gives enough title points to access one right off. Getting weapons is costly because you won't be doing much doa or clearing dungeons in eotn. Don't bother buying an oppressor weapon, you will likely play through wiki content anyways. Buying a single destroyer and tormented weapon won't set you back much compared to the time it takes to acquire through playing the game.

KingAlkaiser · Jul 25, 2012, 08:08 PM // 20:08

Hello first of all thank you very much for all the information and reply i appreciate it a lot.

It has been a while since i played guild wars so bear with me.

my questions:

1)I am have only the eye of the north heroes and i am working on getting the rest this week which small hero team do you recommend for PvE only?
i like the idea of sabway or necromancer team which will all get benefits from soul reaping but does this work well with a player necromancer also ? this would make it 4 necromancer in a single party this seems weird to me lol.
http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/Build:Team_-_Sabway

what about discord way is this for missions only or does it work with outside enemy and clearing quests/etc?

2) I never realized that guild wars saves your templates and builds on your computer so i lost all the stuff i previously had thinking it was saved on servers.

can i get some up to date minion master builds?
i have this so far:

-AotL minion wall or tank build: (used for body blocking and support )

OABDUsx3QyBlMfBKg4BaBVVbhA

*do people still use nowadays veratas sacrifice and also blood of the master to keep minion army alive while running around? i remember using these 2 skills a lot before specially when there was no minion army cap.? ( what is the max amount of minions anyways )

this probably needs a ton of improvements.

2) does Ebon_Battle_Standard_of_Honor buff minion damage? what about great dwarf weapon?

what skills work well with body blocking army?

3) any good builds utilizing the bone fiends as sniper super damage? i can imagine it will include Order of Undeath but won't you kill yourself by using this skill how the heck people keep up with cost of health?

4) is the flesh golem long forgotten i used to love using this golem when i bought factions because of higher level minion and looks but do people even bother with this guy anymore?

5)what about Jagged Bones whats the point in this elite skill if you can get the non version that creates level 16 ones shambling i think it was called? is this only used to maintain army in areas with low body count? or is there some sort of secret behind this?

finally is it true they finally released a minion army icon in the game that allows you to select minions quickly? this sounds extremely useful and was one of the things i wished for before. how doe sit work? is it like hero one where you click spam minions?

any information is greatly appreciated.

P.S- this is my minion bomber i work out:
OABDUsx3QLVHVVBoBfBKgVVbhA is AotL better for bombers? i heard jagged can get you 2 from shambling horror?

yitjuan · Jul 30, 2012, 10:02 AM // 10:02

please use gwpvx.com for your builds.

KingAlkaiser · Jul 30, 2012, 10:06 AM // 10:06

do people still use archane echo to duplicate SS...? what about awakening th blood for the +2 curse magic...?

what is generic human SS builds nowadays anyways n gwpvx they only list hero.

thank you by the way.

Why? · Jul 30, 2012, 02:15 PM // 14:15

the simple answer to all your questions is No. No one runs SS anymore. Panic kills all of its damage, and doesn't let you get hurt as well. Sabway sort of works, but not really as well anymore. For smaller than 8 groups, run the rit builds below, everything but ST can be run on any caster. No one uses any of the verata spells. Most people just use minions for bombing, when they put in the cap they really changed the verata skills. the minion cap is around 10 or 11, it depends on what level your death magic is. Bone Fiends don't get used too much any more. Minions are used to block, and blow up from death nova, and that is about it. They don't really do enough damage in HM to keep them alive. There are too many better elites than Flesh Golem. It just isn't worth bringing. Jagged Bones works with any minions, not just the shambling horror. But AotL is the best MM elite, by far.

The build you play on your own character is totally up to what you like. I love Spirit Spamming, so most of my characters I end up with that. Any spellcaster can do it well enough.

This is the build I just embarrassed WoC HM with
AotL MM
OAhkUwGYoIqkcQVAagC4Wo3EGzFD

Should be a necro hero. They just do it better.

E-Surge Mesmer
OQBDAqwDOngcQGY6Z6GCFhlP
easy stuff. lots of damage.

Illusion Mesmer
OQhkAoB8AGK0LwKACYeWGAJwy3FD

anti physicals.

Panic Mesmer
OQBDAqwDO0gcQGY6Z6GCFhlP

nothing shuts caster groups down better.

Necro Pod Healer
OAhjYgHaIPSzJ3wccaHsEP1qKA

mixed healer with some damage.

Communing Spirit Spammer
OAmjAykqJOfzN3ZLan5c2OzaMA
can be played with any caster class, and some of the physicals as well. I just used this on my Mesmer, without the paragon skill though of course.

SoS
OghjwMhsIPXzyZ1kZKNncDzqHA

again, any caster class can play this role.

ST Rit
OAOjAyhDJPYTrX48x1SgmOzkLA

simple rit prot. At one point minions did make this not worth running, but at this point minions don't effect it at all.

I didn't think of this team build, I found it here.

But positioning and awareness is almost as important as skills in GW. There are times a few steps one way is the difference between being wiped and winning. Although at this point most of those are in WoC or elite areas.

KingAlkaiser · Jul 30, 2012, 04:47 PM // 16:47

wow thank you very much for allt he helpful information i appreciate it a ton.

1) i found it hilarious if i understood correctly that you ran spirit spammer with necromancer was this correct? How well do necro run SoS anyways is this the best choice for me to mop the floor with normal PvE?

2)dam i am lost in the old necromancer ways i still think SS+ archane echo =the best of all for AoE damage and control back when i stop playing there was no such thing as heroes also so i am still new to all of it.

3)how is the discordway i keep reading on the forum is this still viable for pve or is what you mentioned better?

P.S- doesn't the st ritualist get worst with minions like mentioned above somewhere where they say ST rit +MM does not work well?

once again i appreciate all the information i currently do have a panic mesmer but i don't have any more heroes until i beat nightfall which is what i am working towards now.

i have 2 necro->soon to be third with master of whisper
1 ritualist->i have this as the SoS communing healing hero like recommended on gwpvx
1 panic gwen i wish i had 2 more for suggestions.

I am not loving the minion master nerf >.< 11 max minions sucks compared to old days.
i thought SS was still the only thing necro run also lol i am lost in the past.

*by the way i keep re-reading your post and i am confused on what build you run on your human player character and not hero a lot of your ritualist builds can be run with heroes so what do you run personally or recommend to run on human player ? what can i do better than heroes?

Relyk · Jul 30, 2012, 11:20 PM // 23:20

Spirit spammer is a generic build any player can use. It provides a spiritwall and pewpew damage from spirits. This is useful in every area of the game. You get the basic idea from Spirit Farmer for what a spirit spammer is. It has it's own benefits to using normal builds of that profession.
SS fell out of the meta long ago, however it's still very useful in melee heavy areas. It's not regarded highly for normal play like VQs and missions.
Discordway is still part of the meta and widely used. Most people are going to tell you that it's outdated, but I wouldn't listen to that advice until you're familiar with how 7 hero builds work. Discordway is still a fantastically effective and easy way to mow down foes, it works especially well for necromancers.
ST rit and MM do not go well together. Minions can quickly trigger all the spirits because they have low health (Shelter) and they're a meatwall getting attacked (Displacement and/or Union). It also makes them die slower so Death Nova doesn't trigger as often. Fortunately, you don't really need an ST Ritualist until high end content, so run MM for whatever you do. Only start using it if you're wiping from lots of damage or your MM doesn't have enough corpses to work properly. If you aren't using ST rit, that same slot is the SoGM rit anyways.

Now for the rest of your comment. I'd put off getting master of whisperers because you avoid a very annoying mission called Dzagonur Bastion. There is a thread further discussing this. Many people miss the minion cap from the days of old. For players builds, use PvXwiki like it's been suggested already, you will find a few necro builds available to choose from. There is a link to it at the top of the page.

Premium Unleaded · Jul 31, 2012, 02:52 AM // 02:52

Discord is in no way effective at mowing down foes. What it's good at is picking off individual targets at a steady rate.

KingAlkaiser · Aug 04, 2012, 09:38 AM // 09:38

thank you guys for all the suggestion i appreciate it a ton.

my final questions to ask:

I have finally gotten myself some small team of 5 heroes i run normally.

what can i work around with 3 necromancer heroes? i keep hearing a lot of things from people in forums and game but its both sided such as:

SS hero necromancer is this still a viable option or should i look elsewhere? i read the hero meta guide on the forum and it says the heroes don't cast SS on right enemy or as good as a player so what else can i use to spike enemy or damage? or add to my hero collection.

I wish to utilize a team of 1 necromancer player+3 necromancer hero I have so far:

player:
AP MoP Curse:
OAdTYwD7VyO4TwSoMYXcBKmMXEA

necromancer1:master of whisper MM-jagged bones + condition remover
OABCUsp0SVVAagC4pTC4iwWI

*this guy is the new hero i got and i have no clue what i should put him as is 2 minion masters worth the slots or one with jagged and other with AotL? What else can i run on this one?

necromancer 2:Olias MM-bomber AotL
OANDUshvSyBVBoBKg3V1DBEbhA

standard mm bomber i got from websites this one is nice.

necromancer 3: livia my n/rit healer
OAhiYwh8UzyYSzJ3wccWVvYA

*should i keep icy veins or spirit light weapon elite skills?

ritualist 1: the only on i have gotten so far xandra
OACjEyiM5MXzyp3EjxMlmTuhJA

SoS/healer communing ritualist standard from websites nothing new on it.

mesmer 1

anic mesmer gwen
OQBDApwTO0gpnpLHI4kBZglP

and thats it I am currently working into getting a second ritualist for SoGM ritualist and a illusion magic mesmer but i haven't come across any so far I am half way done through nightfall which i never completed.

why do people keep loving/hating discord? I only play normal mode and maybe only hard mode Eye of the north at most for books so what should i make my master of whisper instead of jagged bone minion master number 2?

any suggestion is extremely appreciated, and thank you guys once again for all the help on this thread i appreciate it a ton really ^^.

Lyv · Aug 04, 2012, 10:56 AM // 10:56

Quote:

SS hero necromancer is this still a viable option or should i look elsewhere? i read the hero meta guide on the forum and it says the heroes don't cast SS on right enemy or as good as a player so what else can i use to spike enemy or damage?

SS on heroes is quite sub-par, yes.
Necros don't have many ways to deal sustainable damage. If you insist on using a third nec, you could try either a full curses (with Feast of Corruption or Icy Veins as elite, Desecrate and Defile Enchantments for AoE damage) or Death Magic (Deathly Swarm, Putrid Bile and stuff). Make him paragon secondary for utility such as Stand your ground, Fall back, Never Surrender (and We shall return if you don't mind micro-ing it yourself).

A second MM can be good in areas where there are enough corpses. Also, you don't need many spells to make one a MM, so go nuts with combining the ideas.

Quote:

should i keep icy veins or spirit light weapon elite skills?

Icy Veins is nice, imo.

Quote:

why do people keep loving/hating discord?

A few reasons have already been given here.
It's slower than what you can do nowadays with 7 heroes, but still decent survival-wise.

ritamae · Aug 23, 2012, 10:46 PM // 22:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by akelarumi

Hiya,

First of all in my opinion though Necro can play a suppot role but they are also very good as a damage/nuker. I suspect your using minions? For playing with heroes I would leave the minions to your heroes and run yourself a damage orientated caster build. Using curses like Spitefull spirit are a great way on doing that.

You can also play a necro/rit build with SoS and other spirits very well. (though your spirits aren't as strong then with a rit, you make that up cause you gain energy faster when you kill things.)

I'm no expert but i have to second this. I use SS on myself, and use Olias as an MM. He just does it so much better than I can, quite reliably. In areas where there aren't many dead bodies laying about, I kick Olias and use one of the Rangers. I die sometimes though but doesn't everyone? The elite areas are a huge problem for me though. I tried the UW for the first time the other night and only made it through the first level. For that, I'm at a loss.